Codenstuff.com

And moreover, Xerox, or more specifically, the Palo Alto Research Center (PARC) is the inventor of both the mouse and the Graphical User Interface OS. Apple and Microsoft both came and stole the two inventions, and then Apple sued Microsoft for it..... Something here doesn't make sense.

There is a point where you have to stop looking at things from a legal point of view, and rather from a moral point of view. It's true that Apple has a patent for the "touch to zoom" feature, although that patent is limited, and some may argue Apple should never have gotten it in the first place. However, the real issue here is that Apple is going after everyone who makes products that resemble ever so slightly the iProducts. Because they believe it's wrong to steal? Of course not, thet've been doing it themselves. Because they're not #1 anymore, they don't have the monopoly they once enjoyed. They're scared, and as I said in my previous post, the only way to protect themselves is to hide behind a stack of legal paper.

There's no question Samsung and other manufacturers incorported the "pinch to zoom" feature, but that's like saying most car manufacturers chose to put the horn button on the steering wheel, yet you don't see Toyota suing Ford, do you?

comathi wrote:

And moreover, Xerox, or more specifically, the Palo Alto Research Center (PARC) is the inventor of both the mouse and the Graphical User Interface OS. Apple and Microsoft both came and stole the two inventions, and then Apple sued Microsoft for it..... Something here doesn't make sense.

There is a point where you have to stop looking at things from a legal point of view, and rather from a moral point of view. It's true that Apple has a patent for the "touch to zoom" feature, although that patent is limited, and some may argue Apple should never have gotten it in the first place. However, the real issue here is that Apple is going after everyone who makes products that resemble ever so slightly the iProducts. Because they believe it's wrong to steal? Of course not, thet've been doing it themselves. Because they're not #1 anymore, they don't have the monopoly they once enjoyed. They're scared, and as I said in my previous post, the only way to protect themselves is to hide behind a stack of legal paper.

There's no question Samsung and other manufacturers incorported the "pinch to zoom" feature, but that's like saying most car manufacturers chose to put the horn button on the steering wheel, yet you don't see Toyota suing Ford, do you?

I am going to comment on the last text first, the horn in the middle of the steering wheel is a matter of security while pinch to zoom isn't.
Apple did a deal with Xerox, enabling them to buy $1,000,000 worth of pre-IPO stock in exchange for rights to share in their Alto GUI technology and Stig Martin Eriksson from Sweden invented the trackball in 1959, but it was designed for the cursor on a radar screen (Seems like Xerox stole the basics of the mouse from somewhere?).
Apple deserve to get the patent of something they made, even if people like the feature so much that they illegally implemented it into their products. And of course apple is protecting their products, they don't want other companies to make free replicas.
You also said that they aren't #1 anymore and that they are scared, well they are the company that is the most worth company of all time.

#Update 0:44 am:
Let's take a quick hypocrisy test, would you allow me to use this logo?


No? Because you made it (Just like Apple made the pinch to zoom?)
Yes? Great, i'll use it.

Please reply

Nice logorunar
Btw who are apples and swamguns ? Xd

No, I would not. But please understand the following:

I am in no way, shape or form, denying the fact that Apple owns the patent for the "pinch to zoom" function, nor do I deny the fact that Samsung, like many other companies, have incorporated this feature into their own products, very obviously without Apple's agreement.

However

I do think Apple should have never been granted the patent in the first place, and especially not sue companies using the same technology. We're talking about a feature everyone's now used to. Whether that's because of Apple or not doesn't matter. The issue here is that over the years, Apple has sued and sued and sued again, for the most ridiculous things. It's getting on a lot of people's nerves (and you can probably see that includes me).

But that said, here's why I'm even debating the subject:

As I've said above, I don't deny the fact that Apple owns any of the patents it claims it does. That's the point. I don't look at this from a legal point of view, because obviously, Apple won that part. Once again, I'm looking at this from a moral point of view. What Apple is doing is, in my opinion, wrong. There's a fine line between protecting your intellectual property and anti-trust actions. Apple has crossed it, so did Microsoft (and they got sued for it in 1994).

Basically, what I'm saying here is that what Apple is doing is not legally, but rather morally wrong, and if they want to ensure a better future for technology, they should stop it right now.

Now, back to the logo
I see what you did there, and call me a hypocrite if you want :lol:

I designed the logo to represent something, Comathi. Someone else taking the logo and editing it means mine is no longer unique, it doesn't do it's job of representing Comathi. However, Apple invented a technology that now allows 1.08 billion people, "legally" or not, to control graphics that are displayed on a touch screen. It's awesome and the majority of mobile users love it. I don't think anybody could imagine a new phone coming out without a touch screen, or the multi-touch gestures that come with it. My sincerest congratulations go to Apple for the lasting legacy they've created.

See, when it comes to things like phones, users have certain expectations, and it's the manufacturer's job to make sure their product meets those expectations. Apple's actions are preventing manufacturers to do so, because said actions are meant to ensure Apple and Apple only will ever satisfy users. That's called monopoly.

I don't have much more to say, so I guess it's about time I stop debating.

I must say, though, that this was very interesting, and I hope there are no hard feelings between us after this :lol:

Until the next debate ;)

-Comathi

comathi wrote:

No, I would not. But please understand the following:

I am in no way, shape or form, denying the fact that Apple owns the patent for the "pinch to zoom" function, nor do I deny the fact that Samsung, like many other companies, have incorporated this feature into their own products, very obviously without Apple's agreement.

However

I do think Apple should have never been granted the patent in the first place, and especially not sue companies using the same technology. We're talking about a feature everyone's now used to. Whether that's because of Apple or not doesn't matter. The issue here is that over the years, Apple has sued and sued and sued again, for the most ridiculous things. It's getting on a lot of people's nerves (and you can probably see that includes me).

But that said, here's why I'm even debating the subject:

As I've said above, I don't deny the fact that Apple owns any of the patents it claims it does. That's the point. I don't look at this from a legal point of view, because obviously, Apple won that part. Once again, I'm looking at this from a moral point of view. What Apple is doing is, in my opinion, wrong. There's a fine line between protecting your intellectual property and anti-trust actions. Apple has crossed it, so did Microsoft (and they got sued for it in 1994).

Basically, what I'm saying here is that what Apple is doing is not legally, but rather morally wrong, and if they want to ensure a better future for technology, they should stop it right now.

Now, back to the logo
I see what you did there, and call me a hypocrite if you want :lol:

I designed the logo to represent something, Comathi. Someone else taking the logo and editing it means mine is no longer unique, it doesn't do it's job of representing Comathi. However, Apple invented a technology that now allows 1.08 billion people, "legally" or not, to control graphics that are displayed on a touch screen. It's awesome and the majority of mobile users love it. I don't think anybody could imagine a new phone coming out without a touch screen, or the multi-touch gestures that come with it. My sincerest congratulations go to Apple for the lasting legacy they've created.

See, when it comes to things like phones, users have certain expectations, and it's the manufacturer's job to make sure their product meets those expectations. Apple's actions are preventing manufacturers to do so, because said actions are meant to ensure Apple and Apple only will ever satisfy users. That's called monopoly.

I don't have much more to say, so I guess it's about time I stop debating.

I must say, though, that this was very interesting, and I hope there are no hard feelings between us after this :lol:

Until the next debate ;)

-Comathi

Hypocrisy! You don't want me to use the logo? It's made out of 3 circles, do you own the circles? It would be stupid that someone can have copyright over circles. We're talking about something everyone's now used to (circles).
So you wouldn't sue me if i started using your logo all the time, it's the "same technology".

In the last reply i said:

RunarM wrote:

And of course apple is protecting their products, they don't want other companies to make free replicas.

Some changes that you might like:
And of course Comathi is protecting his "product", he don't want other people to make free replicas. The logo I created is not an edited version of your logo, it's a custom made logo, 3 circles, different colors and different font. I didn't look at your logo when i created it.

You know how Apple is going after companies who steal their patented technology? Google does that too, just recently they sued Apple for the notification bar. A feature that everyone has gotten used to, isn't it, how do you say. morally wrong, they should stop it if they want better future for technology. Google’s Motorola sues Apple for Siri - don't talk to your phone, Google owns that now. But hey, what about Samsung? They sued Apple for using 3 of their Universal Mobile Telecommunications System, they are suing Apple for emoticon input method for mobile terminal and so much more!
There's a fine line between protecting your intellectual property and anti-trust actions, and it seems like many big companies tend to cross it.

Apple made "pinch to zoom" and when someone else takes the feature and edit it, then that means it is no longer unique, it doesn't do it's job of representing the uniqueness Apple. And yes, the users have certain expectations when a new mobile phone comes out and if everyone has the same features then Apple would lose money and eventually run out of business.

I don't like patents on software and i don't agree on all of the lawsuits. But when other companies continues stealing so much from another company (Not only Apple) then something have to be done. Samsung could have bought a license to use the technology, just like Microsoft did - but they choose the pirate way and crime doesn't pay.

Let me talk more about how Samsung steal stuff, Look at their official Windows 8 application "S-Launcher" (It's going to be included in all of Samsungs computers! Take a look at it:

That looks like a combination of Windows and OS X!

Coincidence? (Apple has patented their docks, big surprise right?)

-RunarM

I give up. Consider yourself the winner if you want.

I've thought more about this, and I found I was more or less debating the software should be open source. So I'll stop here, because I don't see how you can efficiently debate open source vs closed source without bringing up the same arguments all the time.

Good game ;)

comathi wrote:

I give up. Consider yourself the winner if you want.

I've thought more about this, and I found I was more or less debating the software should be open source. So I'll stop here, because I don't see how you can efficiently debate open source vs closed source without bringing up the same arguments all the time.

Good game ;)

Open source vs closed source? How can you say that you was debating for open source when your software isn't even open source... http://www.comathi.com/software.html
What's that called? Oh yeah... hypocrite?

The game doesn't end just because you choose to leave.

-RunarM

Fight! Fight! Fight! .."Ding ding"

comathi brushes up on his ninja training

RunarM pumps some iron
comathi strikes the first blow
RunarM bounces back with the bum whip

..place your bets now :lol:

Apple are getting quite silly with these court cases though as they seem to be suing every manufacturer that makes phones and/or tablet computers for stupid reasons which as I said before could easily be resolved by all involved agreeing on a simple license fee for whatever features/designs Apple are moaning about. Apple now want to ban all of Samsung's latest smart phones from being sold which to me sounds like their way of trying to stop competition with their own iPhone and the holiday season is approaching which is the busiest time of year for any tech company and if Samsung phones get banned that would give Apple a big boost in sales which is the only reason I think they are requesting a ban - its stupid!. The S-Launcher is just a dock and it doesnt look anything like the OS X one apart from its a dock and its in the middle of the screen (stupid place to put either of them I think lol) .

codenstuff steps in and issues a blow

CodenStuff wrote:

Apple are getting quite silly with these court cases though as they seem to be suing every manufacturer that makes phones and/or tablet computers for stupid reasons which as I said before could easily be resolved by all involved agreeing on a simple license fee for whatever features/designs Apple are moaning about. Apple now want to ban all of Samsung's latest smart phones from being sold which to me sounds like their way of trying to stop competition with their own iPhone and the holiday season is approaching which is the busiest time of year for any tech company and if Samsung phones get banned that would give Apple a big boost in sales which is the only reason I think they are requesting a ban - its stupid!. The S-Launcher is just a dock and it doesnt look anything like the OS X one apart from its a dock and its in the middle of the screen (stupid place to put either of them I think lol) .

“In October 2010, Apple offered to license its portfolio of patents to Samsung provided the Korean company was willing to pay on the order of $30 per smartphone and $40 per tablet."
Samsung declined the offer they got from Apple to license their patents, unlike Microsoft who purchased the license from Apple for their surface tablet.
S-Launcher isn't infringing any patents as i know but i think it looks like Apples OS X dock

-RunarM

I have no response at the moment I will consult my legal team and get back to you. (now where can I find a legal team :?)

This response does not count as a response.